Copyright infringement

shadow · Post by **shadow** » Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:58 pm

Does anyone know if its legal to manipulate/change someone elses sound effect so its unrecognisable to the original.
How much change is necessary to become something "New"

Anyone with experience with this?

vrageprogrammer · Post by **vrageprogrammer** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 6:26 am

It IS legal to manipulate someone's music but not legal to use it commercially. And it is NOT possible to edit someone's music so that it is unrecognizable.....And as far as games go, use only free music or music that you made or have prior permission to use!

shadow · Post by **shadow** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:45 pm

Well actually I was talking about sound effects, not music and you have to be careful about free music.

Most free music is not really free as you might think.
Free to download and listen to but not free to use as you wish, unless it states clearly you can use it for any purpose.

And as far as games go, use only free music or music that you made or have prior permission to use!

Thanks for the "Tip"

Anyone with real experience with this?

Post by **paradoxnj** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 3:04 pm

It is NOT legal to manipulate anyone's sounds or use them for any commercial or non-commercial use. This would be the same as learning "Enter Sandman" on the guitar, changing one note and calling it yours. The original work is copyrighted, therefore anything derived from that work requires permission.

Free to download and listen to but not free to use as you wish

This is also illegal. You cannot download music without paying for it. Hence why Napster was sued.

vrageprogrammer · Post by **vrageprogrammer** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 3:27 pm

You can use ROYALTY FREE music in any of your work!

Post by **bernie** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:33 pm

Record sound effects youself. There is no Copyright on natural sounds (at least not yet anyway, although I'm sure that day will come when someone will copyright the sound of you farting

). As for music you CAN use any music that is in public domain. EG. traditional irish or celtic music provided you either play it yourself ,or, if you can't play an instrument, use a midi sequencer to produce the music and convert it to wav format (not as satifactory as playing the music on a real instrument). Failing that get permission of the copyright holder(s) usually a record company who will rip you off for as much as they can. Or write the music yourself.

shadow · Post by **shadow** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:35 pm

Thanks paradoxnj for the info. Much appreciated.

I was thinking if I took a "sound effect", reversed and inverted it, changed the speed, tempo and pitch, added reverb and echo it has become something completely different and unique.

As for "Free to download", you took my statement out of context since (on my previous line) I was talking about free music and effects .
There are lots of sites out there that offer free music and effects to "Download".

Don't jump to conclusions that everyone steals music.
But I understand your point since you are a muscian?

shadow · Post by **shadow** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:48 pm

Thanks bernie, some good info.

Also there are alot of magazines that offer free samples and music to be used as you wish.
The problem is you can collect alot of free sounds, samples and music over the years and lose track where you got it to begin with.

Any of the effects I use are either made by me or obtained from magazines stating they are free to use as I wish.
My worry was, what if something slipped through over the years but was heavily modified by me, where do I stand legally?

Post by **bernie** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:37 pm

The answer is simple really. If there is any doubt don't use it. Make a new one yourself. If you cant' find a natural sound create it. Music on the other hand is a minefield, best to stick with known public domain stuff played by yourself or someone who will play it for you, and even then get it in writing that you have permission to use it. Or as I said before use a sequencer to make it. The old stuff is always the best, modern music is mostly shight (in my opinion) anyway.

Post by **paradoxnj** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 7:27 pm

vrageprogrammer wrote:You can use ROYALTY FREE music in any of your work!

Of course...that is because you have PERMISSION.

Post by **paradoxnj** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 7:46 pm

shadow wrote: I was thinking if I took a "sound effect", reversed and inverted it, changed the speed, tempo and pitch, added reverb and echo it has become something completely different and unique.

Because it was based from an original work that does not belong to you is what makes it illegal. If you're going to put that much effort into modifying it, you may as well just make the sound yourself as bernie said. It would take you more time to learn the correct way to use the sound editing tool to get what you want than it would to actually make the sound.

As for "Free to download", you took my statement out of context since (on my previous line) I was talking about free music and effects .
There are lots of sites out there that offer free music and effects to "Download".
Don't jump to conclusions that everyone steals music.

The conversation was about copyright infringement. That is why your statement was "taken out of context". I also was making a statement about "free" music. No where did I say or even come close to saying "everyone steals music". If someone says "Free to listen to but not use" it wouldn't make much sense. If you load it on your iPod you are "using it", if you add it to your iTunes music library it's being used...either it's public domain or not public domain, there is no in between.

But I understand your point since you are a muscian?

Being a musician has nothing to do with this. Doing the right thing does....

bernie wrote: The answer is simple really. If there is any doubt don't use it.

Couldn't have said it better myself.