4 questions

[realgaming135]

Hi
Already time for a new topic 4 new problems.

Number 1 question:
I made a level with a terrain added with StaticMesh entity. So I decided to put up a grid, but the transparent places in the grid texture is making some troubles with the terrain model. The grid texture is tga-format. When you look through the grid, it seems like making holes in the terrain, and through there, I'm able to see the skybox. The grid is flagged as 'sheet' in the brush attributes menu. This is what it looks like:

holes in terrain.jpg

(139.96 KiB) Not downloaded yet

Number 2 question:
In the very same level I decided to make a little lake, but it is making similar problems when you make it transparent in the face attributes menu. This is what it looks like:

holes in terrain underwater.jpg

(115.35 KiB) Not downloaded yet

Number 3 question:
The character model is looking really dark in the same level. Normally you are able to see the textures on the model, but here he's almost too dark. Here is a picture of the normal model and the dark one:

lightning on models.jpg (53.34 KiB) Viewed 8793 times

Number 4 question:
How do I make projectiles (like a bullet or grenade) collide with the terrain model? (added as StaticMesh). When ever I shoot at the ground or so, the bullet or grenade goes right through the terrain, instead of colliding with it.

Is there any way to solve these problems?
Thanks for any reply

[Veleran]

1.It must be a Bsp using transparency,and the StaticMesh doe not want this at all.
You must add the transparent things as separate Staticmesh.
And if you do,avoid any polygon collisions in the transparent actor.

2.Again,better not intersected with the staticmesh any Bsp that uses transparency.

3. I can not say i know how to fix this ,the player possibly does not get the ambient light increase from the staticmesh like the bsp does and if the actor is limited just to what light he can catch from the light sources,
You could try to place extra lights there to light up any approaching actors (if there are no bsp near it to get over bright).

4.The staticmesh does that.You can try bsp terrain -might work better.
The GenSurf of the tools folder can make you a terrain from a 8-bit displace .bmp bitmap.
Adjust the peaks and lowest height in the Bitmap tab-for example :Map color 0 to:,and Map color 255 to:2048 (for a large terrain like of width/length 4096,smaller ones need much much less extra height boost)
Write the .map,import the terrain .map in Rf editor,Etc

When you are done testing the gameplay ion the bsp terrain,add a Staticmesh entity of the same shape and size in the same place.
To create it you can Import the same terrain brushes from Rf editor in a modelling program,keep only the top polygons,weld vertices so it can be smooth instead of faced (i hope not vertice by vertice,but all together using a method or modifier)
The old Bsp brushes can be flagged as clip so they will not be rendered.

I would also say create convex triangle brushes in your modelling program and deform them in height but i do not know if you can find a .map exporter for any modeler.
The simpler the terrain the more possible that Rf will handle it.

[realgaming135]

Hi and thanks for the reply

1. Would it work if I made the fence a part of the terrain, and then imported it to RF as a single model?

2. Well, I guess that means that I can't make a lake there. I would not be able to place water anywhere at the terrain.

3. Found a solution by an accident. The surrounding box is flagged as 'sky'. I unflagged the bottom floor of this box, and then the character model was in normal light again.

4. Making the terrain in bsp geometry results in too much level geometry. The editor becomes very slow, and it begins to crash.

[Veleran]

You can use bsp terrain if you put liquid and try to light the ground in a way it does not show faced,i do not guarantee that.
The Gensurf has a decimate slider to optimize ,if it does not import,then you can use less divisions.
Place the terrains in groups and i think with terrain of 2048 brushes you can make something to run and play.

Place staticmesh fence and other transparent.The staticmesh has extra checking for visibility and Zsort to correct transparency and distortions comparing to the staticEntityProxy.
You can also use staticentity proxy but you should aslo possibly disable the flashing lights of the explosions and weapons because they can light up the sep if the lights are near the Sep origin.
And, a bigger terrain needs a light with radius few or several tens thousand texels radius to reach all corners with enough intensity.

[Veleran]

http://nemesis.thewavelength.net/index.php?p=8

This editor can export bsp for collision and the solid mesh as .Obj , .Dxf to use for the Staticmesh that matches the shape,and then you can texture the mesh in your modelling program and export.

Check the "View/Walk on Terrain" and then you can move around using WASD keys and use the raise/lower ,touch up tool and others to form the surface.

It would be much easier this way than through Gensurf where you have to export the 3ds through the RFeditor to 3ds and so on.
Uncheck the hint and sky in the .map / options/exportation tab.
P.S.No need to get in the trouble to find .Wads and try texture the terrain there,we re interested in the collision brushes and the mesh sheet.Anyway i do not know if Rf can import textured bsp settings from there.

[realgaming135]

Hi Veleran

I already use Nem's Terrain Generator, because it's easier to use and easier to focus on vertexes when the terrain is textured

You say that I can add a StaticMesh (textured) with no collision, and then add the terrain again in level geometry (flagged as clip) in the same spot as the StaticMesh. That will solve the collision problem.
But I was thinking, what if you use StaticEntityProxy to that? It has no problem with transparent textures, and if there is no collision, I can do the same with the terrain made of level geometry and flagged as clip. And there will be no problem with the bounding box. And the water problem will be solved, maybe. I haven't tested it yet, but do you think it would work?

[Veleran]

You first open the .map collision give them a quick texture and run level preview,you think about the smooth actor mesh much later.Better delay aas much as possible the creation of the actor terrain to avoid doing work that you might not use.

Sure,put Static entity proxy the outdoor terrain,and have the transparent water liquids.
If you do not mind having no light flashes in the effects.Otherwise the terrain flashes on firing and explosions and flames etc.
Before the staticmesh was added we used the Sep. Put fill color to 0 0 0 unless you want that steady fixed side ways lightning-its fake and works in cases where you have no level lights.

[realgaming135]

Ok then, I tried to use StaticEntityProxy, and the fps dropped a bit sadly, but maybe with a little fog and farclipping it will work. The bad thing is, that this terrain is gonna be the training level, but if the terrain flashes when something explode, or you fire a gun and flames, then I might consider using bsp terrain, and use fog and farclipping, even though I hoped to use skybox
I just have a little question, but not sure if you know the answer: Why does a big StaticEntityProxy model drop the fps, while the StaticMesh model is doing almost nothing to the fps?

[Veleran]

How much less fps do you get,is it still playable?
The flashing thing is not hard to remove,just backup the weapon ini and then use muzzle flash and explosions for the weapons and projectiles that do not use the dynamic lights.
You can remove the lights effects in the explosion ini.

Ι run some tests to check frame rate differences and the specific static entity gave 20 frames less speed than a Static Mesh of the same.

if you want uniform outdoor directional lightning without light spots here and there,you can use the Static Entity
and the water.

If you want some texture variety you can duplicate some terrain polygons and map them with transparent textures like grass patches ,fossils,road cobble etc.If you are still in the stage of getting a prototype bare static entity just to test the basic mechanics and systems,there is not need adding such details yet.
Just make sure each layer is above the other by a small 0.001 amount or something,so all texture layers can render.
I know you did not ask about texturing and it is not a problem of the time being but i thought to mention it anyway.
And as you said,there is always the Bsp terrain.

[realgaming135]

It is kind of playable, and also not. (what I mean is you can walk around and do whatever you want to do, but the fps is down at 10 somethimes).
Thanks for the information about texturing, it is always good to know something about it.

I can make it playable if I use farclipping and fog. But then I'll have to remove the skybox. But that's not that bad, because then I'll just pretend it's a foggy day

[realgaming135]

okay, I'm sorry that I have to take more your peoples time, but it didn't work with the static entity proxy either:

sep.jpg

(102.49 KiB) Not downloaded yet

[Veleran]

You can scale up the liquid model so the water box bottom comes out below the terrain
Leave the terrain Bsp to solid non transparent for the moment because the clip brushes made the player swim through the terrain on some places and finally falling over the edge of the water (and put optimized texture scale and lightmap scale to max 20 in the face properties )
You have to raise the static entity proxy Y to 1 texel higher so it is raised over the Bsp not clipped between the water model.
I do not know about other modeler but after i exported from max a test terrain actor the rotation i used in the editor for the Sep actor was -90 0 0 ,instead of the default 0 180 0.0.
Yes,you have to use the far clip plane and distance fog.

[realgaming135]

I think I'm just gonna give up about those lakes because it is still doing it. I scaled the water as you said, and I made the terrain bsp to solid, but it does not work. I did not think that the StaticEntityProxy would react the same way to water as StaticMesh. I think I'm gonna make another terrain without lakes, That would solve it all.
But still many thanks for posting all those replies, and thanks for using all this time on my problem.
Unless there is another way to do this, I will create another terrain, not meant for water.

[Veleran]

I searched quickly for a place to upload an example,found that place and i hope the link works.

http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?fi ... 3773621630



I know that the shores are very sharp ,but i did not have the time to make a couple of rocks and reeds static entities to cover it.
The example terrain is very basic,just to check the settings like:
The Y position of the static entity proxy is 1 texel above 0 and the bsp collision brushes.

Point the level editor options directories to the ones you use and choose the default2.txl,where i put the water texture.
The textures are from CG Textures,which are free.
You can extract the water texture from the txl using Rf pack tool and put it in another txl if you want.

[realgaming135]

There, was only a screenshot, a 3DT file and a txl file in the download, so I could not see it with the staticentityproxy model. And I could not of some weird reason compile the level. And I also pointed the level editor directories to mine, and I used default2.txl.
Anyway, I atleast got an idea of what you wanted to show me. So I did that: made the bsp terrain solid and non-transparent, and I placed the terrain model 1 texel above the bsp terrain. But the model still make those strange holes. The only difference is that I now can see the bsp terrain texture through there. And by the way, when I am in the water, it looks like im in air.

I must be doing something wrong every time, because, it do not look like, that you have those problems. Atleast I can't see any of those holes in the screenshot.